It strikes me that Trueman could have said about the same thing about Greek and Roman culture, yet that did not prevent Paul from saying he would be Jew to the Jew, Greek to the Greek, and so on in 1 Corinthians 9:20. A debauched culture is still a culture, and it’s what most people in the history of the world have had, even if we draw the line pretty generously for defining a non-debauched culture.
Very good point. I think the impetus for Trueman’s point is the breathtaking speed with which our so-called “Christianized” culture has disintegrated in recent years. The gloss is well and truly gone, and there is no sense in which we can claim our Western culture is enlightened, civilized and refined. It reminds me of the recent Babylon Bee article; “Postmillennialism Drops Out of Eschatological Race.”
Tyler is a pastor in Olympia, WA and works in State government.
Ten years ago, I entered the “real world” by taking on a secular job. It didn’t take me long to realize that they knew absolutely nothing about God, the Bible, or Christianity. The vast majority had never been in a church for anything except an occasional wedding. I had to adapt to my surroundings. I tell people one of the first things I had to do was start my “Romans Road” in Chapter One instead of Chapter Three.
I had to learn to “engage” the culture (or anti-culture as it were). By engage, I mean that I had to be familiar with how they thought, their philosophy of life, their interests, etc. Engaging is not embracing, but it does mean that I had to move out of my comfort zone and even learn a new language. (“Are you saved?” “From what?!” or “Do you know Jesus?” “Yeah. He works in receiving.”)
"Some things are of that nature as to make one's fancy chuckle, while his heart doth ache." John Bunyan
Tyler, agreed that it’s fast, but witness the rapidity with which the Roman republic was replaced by the Caesars—or for that matter the rapidity with which Roman vassal kings turned on the previous ruling classes. Or, for that matter, the rapidity with which large portions of Europe, especially England and portions of Switzerland, France, and the Hapsburg dominions—adopted variations of Protestantism. I think we’ve been there before.
Discussion
NewDebauched culture....
It strikes me that Trueman could have said about the same thing about Greek and Roman culture, yet that did not prevent Paul from saying he would be Jew to the Jew, Greek to the Greek, and so on in 1 Corinthians 9:20. A debauched culture is still a culture, and it’s what most people in the history of the world have had, even if we draw the line pretty generously for defining a non-debauched culture.
Aspiring to be a stick in the mud.
NewBert
Very good point. I think the impetus for Trueman’s point is the breathtaking speed with which our so-called “Christianized” culture has disintegrated in recent years. The gloss is well and truly gone, and there is no sense in which we can claim our Western culture is enlightened, civilized and refined. It reminds me of the recent Babylon Bee article; “Postmillennialism Drops Out of Eschatological Race.”
Tyler is a pastor in Olympia, WA and works in State government.
NewWe Live in a Pagan World
Ten years ago, I entered the “real world” by taking on a secular job. It didn’t take me long to realize that they knew absolutely nothing about God, the Bible, or Christianity. The vast majority had never been in a church for anything except an occasional wedding. I had to adapt to my surroundings. I tell people one of the first things I had to do was start my “Romans Road” in Chapter One instead of Chapter Three.
I had to learn to “engage” the culture (or anti-culture as it were). By engage, I mean that I had to be familiar with how they thought, their philosophy of life, their interests, etc. Engaging is not embracing, but it does mean that I had to move out of my comfort zone and even learn a new language. (“Are you saved?” “From what?!” or “Do you know Jesus?” “Yeah. He works in receiving.”)
"Some things are of that nature as to make one's fancy chuckle, while his heart doth ache." John Bunyan
NewJulius Caesar
Tyler, agreed that it’s fast, but witness the rapidity with which the Roman republic was replaced by the Caesars—or for that matter the rapidity with which Roman vassal kings turned on the previous ruling classes. Or, for that matter, the rapidity with which large portions of Europe, especially England and portions of Switzerland, France, and the Hapsburg dominions—adopted variations of Protestantism. I think we’ve been there before.
Aspiring to be a stick in the mud.